Africa Grey New Starter

[AGNewbie]

HI. I'm Sam from Wales and am now the proud new owner of a baby African Grey called Jasper. I've only had him for a couple of days, so needless to say I'm quite apprehensive about settling him in. He seems to have settled in okay, but still seems wary of me. Getting him to start stepping up is proving difficult. I know it's early days but some hints on this would be appreciated. I've read all the books on providing a stable perch with your fingers and making him off balance to grasp your fingers. He's not very steady and holds on to his perch for grim death! This is something that I need him to start doing at an early age without savaging my fingers off when he's older? Can anyone give me any tips for building his trust and confidence in stepping up?

Cheers

Sam

[Clive]

Hi Sam and welcome!! How's Wales? Huh...you shall be talking with your grey constantly and be with it as many time as possible!!


 

[skunkette]

hi Sam welcome you didn't say how old jasper was . Tia was 17 week when we got her not steady on her feet too i used the finger with the steady hand from having her about a week. if you don't pull away and handle daily,  jasper should  never take off your finger maybee give you hard squeeze if he thinks hes falling or pestered. a friend of mine has cag who's 35 years old and she still likes to nibble fingers

[CaptainQuark]

Hi Sam,

Welcome to the forum!

I've put together a few notes on the subject of gaining the trust of your grey here. I work in parrot rescue as an ACO for Birdline-UK and this article is about rehab of older parrots based on my experiences with our two rescue greys, Induna and Inenekazi. The principles are the same, but it should be easier for you since your youngster is alreday reasonably comfortable in human company.

As for the stepping up, a common mistake when people start train their birds is that they forget the "up" bit and hold their hand too low.  You need to put your hand in front of Jasper, touching his chest about half way up the breast bone so that he does actually have to step up onto your hand. If you hold your hand too low, he will have to steady himself with his beak, which can lead to 'beaking', which, if you are even a little bit nervous about his beak, can lead to a full-blown biting habit that could take years to break.

To make things easier, you need to know what his absolutely favourite treat is – peanuts, for example. Don't give them to him at any time other than when you are training him and don't give him a whole one either. Shell one and cut the peanuts in half. Then put your hand up to his breastbone, holding the peanut in the other hand where he can reach it when he is on your hand. Give him lots and lots of praise and give him the treat. Then repeat the process in reverse to get him to step down again.

Oh – and do not try this training anywhere near his cage! That's his turf and he will defend it tooth (or should that be "beak") and claw! The bathroom is good place – just make sure the lid's down so he can't drown himself.

Hope some of that helps!

CQ

[AGNewbie]

Hi!

Thanks for the warm welcome and tips on getting Jasper to step up. It's great to hear from people with experience. I've been doing all of the mistakes you mentioned QC - trying to get him out of the cage by stepping up (strangely enough this tip doesn't come out in the books), holding my hand level or just above his feet, etc... He is beaking, which is fine as I'm not nervous bout that, but he's beaking a bit too hard, so I want to make sure he doesn't turn into a biter! When he's out of his cage he's starting to play a bit more with foot toys (wiffle ball and dice), and he will come over to me for some scratches, which isn't bad after a couple of days in. He's 12 weeks old but I'm told quite big for his age (CAG). He doesn't seem to be a 'morning' parrot. He's much more active and tends to eat late afternoon early evening. So some of his personality is coming out already! I'll click on to your link CQ and pick up some more handy tip.

Thanks again guys for the posts!

[sharla]

both my boy birds as babies beaked a little hard.  One Amos beaked so much he actually gnawed like a puppy would.  I called him a  puppy bird.  Both girls beaked gently.  Wonder if its a gender thing.   

[CaptainQuark]

He's 12 weeks old but I'm told quite big for his age (CAG)

 

I sincerely hope that the "big for his age" thing is because he isn't 12 weeks old! That is FAR too young! There is no way that he can have been properly weaned by that age.

There are those that believe that selling unweaned youngsters and having their new owners complete the weaning process will mean that the chick bonds more closely with its owner. This practise is fairly common in the USA. But in my experience, it leads to all kinds of problems – both physical, as unless you are experienced in weaning chicks, you may get the diet wrong causing deficiencies that can cause ill health in later life, and psychological, as the bird will believe that he is a human, not a parrot!

This is not your fault, though, so don't think I'm criticising you, but I consider the breeder in question to be seriously irresponsible!

[sharla]

WELL i don't know about that.  I hand fed all of mine.  The lady that bred them is a retired nurse practioner and I came over several times to lean how to do it and all the pitfalls to watch for.  And as a pharmacist I understand very well about bacterial contamination, aspiration, the damage too hot food can make, and with her available for any questions regarding the weaning process it went well.  I do realize there are some people too dumb to do anything by themselves.  That is why when filling prescriptions we have to write the instructions for the dumbest possible person.  We have to be certain that we say "unwrap and insert the suppository rectally"  There have been many cases where people would call back and the foil on the suppository tore their behind.  I think it depends on the person doing the feeding and their level of intelligence and capability.  (sometimes I even think we should define what we mean by rectally as I'm sure that is something even some people can't understand)   I have found that "blanket" rules are stupid and there are cases where they just don't apply.  there is something called "professional judgement"  It basically means taking the body of known information, interpreting it, applying it to the case at hand and making the best decision with what you have available to you, or course weighing the risk to the benefits.  Always do that.   I got mine when they were down to two feedings a day.  Because I had to work,  They were also already eating other foods.  so if they got hungry during the day they had plenty available.  We all really enjoyed this time together, it was very pleasureable for all of us.  And all my birds love me whole heartedly.  I didn't buy them to be wild birds.  I bought them to be my family members.  And just like with baby humans the more handling and socialization they get at the younger ages the better off for them.   But as we are all grown ups and I value your opinion on many things I hope we can agree to disagree on this one.  With the caveat that the person getting the  bird has been evaluated by the breeder and is actually "capable" of handling the responsibility.   

[CaptainQuark]

… I hope we can agree to disagree on this one.  …

I state and strongly defend my beliefs. That doesn't mean that I don't understand that others have different beliefs. We can disagree on this one. 

[AGNewbie]

Hi CQ and Sharla

Thanks for both your opinions (CQ - you can ignore my request as to where your post was about this in my earlier replay to you since I've obviously now found it). The breeder did in deed state that by finishing the weaning process it would increase my bond with Jasper. Additionally they also said that the birds can imprint on the breeder if they are still with them much after 12 weeks. He has formula twice a day, morning and evening, and he is left plenty of sprouting pulses, fresh fruit and veg. and of course water through out the day. Three times a week I give him 3/4 drops of calivet since I beilieve greys can have a calcium deficiency. This is why it is important for me to get him out of the cage, although I've found letting him either climb out himself or getting him on to a wooden pole I'm holding seems to work.

He's still doesn't like it when I put my hand in the cage and will try to move away, but he does come to me once out. I'm not sure if that's down to his age or if he's still getting used to me. As I said in my reply to you CQ before I had a chance to read your latest post, the birds at the breeder all appeared to be well looked after and contented, and the breeder has had at least 10 years experience with breeding greys. I was surprised that he wasn't fully weaned, but I don't believe that the breeder would have given me Jasper if he thought I was unsuitable.

I have to say that I can see both of your points of view on this. He seems happy but I would appreciate advice to ensure he does have all the vitamins and minerals he needs, as well as ensuring he is well adjusted.

Cheers

Sam

[AGNewbie]

Hi there. I hope everyone had a good Christmas. I didn't want to start a new post/topic but I'm quite pleased with Jasper's progress in the last week....the step up training has paid off and he's stepping up on to my hand during training with no problems. He'll also step up most of the time generally, and will do so when he wants to come out of the cage. He also likes his 'cuddles' and will happily sit on my lap having his head scratched.The change in just over the week I've had him is staggering.

I would like some advice as to how to get him used to other people and dogs. He's fine with me now but I don't want him to be a 'one person' bird, otherwise he'll be miserable when I have to go away with work/holiday, which does happen occasionally. Any advice on this?

Cheers

Sam

[sharla]

when Zu ZU was a baby I exposed her to many different people.  I just let her be in the room with them and those that had bird experience would have her step up for them.  I also took her a lot of places, different places to expose her to different environments.  It seems to have paid of as she is the nicest most social bird I have.  She will go to anyone anywhere anytime.  She has never bitten anyone and I would trust a child to let them hold her.  if 10 or over of course.  With no worries she would bite.  She never has.  Due to illness I didn't have quite as much opportunity to take Audie around as much.  She decided she didn't like my boyfriend at all for no reason, just didn't.  And even today there are people she does and doesn't like.  I have taken her various places,  in fact all of them.  I put all six in one big carrier to take them to the vet and the vet and vet techs did comment they were some of the nicest behaved greys they had seen.  So many are grumpy.  I think it benefits them to have new experiences.  I didn't believe that junk about not moving the cages around either.  I move mine around all the time and always have and nobody has ever noticed, plucked a feather or gotten upset.  In fact they seem to like it.  Keep in mine I got all mine as babies at 2 feedings a day and made a point to introduce them to change and new things.  They have been around dogs, cats, horses, pigs, you name it.  My little conure once picked a fight with a blue jay and won.  He is a stinker.  I'm really proud of that because I have seen blue jays attack big hawks.  They are fearless.  I did once take her to someone's house who was astounded I didn't use a stick to carry her around with.  I was like "A stick?"  what for?  I'm not afraid of bites on my hands.  So I don't get bitten.  Plus I respect their space when they show they want me to back off.  I had one Zeke who was like that but he is now happily stepping up following me around cuddling etc.  He still prefers to come out of the cage on his own so I let him.  then he comes to me.    Now if I had gotten a grown bird with issues the story might be different and the above would not apply.

[AGNewbie]

Hi Sharla

Thanks for the tips. We stayed over at my dad's over X-mas and he was fine. He isn't bothered by travelling in the car either. Unfortunately I couldn't let him roam about that much as he has a Jack Russell. On showing Jasper Titch (the dog, Jasper was still in the cage), he promptly puffed up and took a strike in his general direction. So not keen on dogs. I think Titch would be okay but Jasper would probably have a go trying to de-fur here! He didn't seem bothered if she was walking around the cage provided it was high up. What would you recommend for introducing dog and bird?

He's still very choosy about when he'll step up away from the training session but he will do it sometimes. I think sometimes he gets fed up with me scratching him sometimes and he makes a pft...pft type noise and beaks me rather than bites. I take it that he's fed up and wants to go an do something else? Otherwise he's coming along fine I think.

Cheers

Sam