Hi this topic line was reported to me as having gotten a bit out of hand. I have reviewed the posts and it seems this particular line has been running since last year sometime. Perhaps since it seems to have degenerated into personal insults instead of mature discussion it would be best to end this thread. I would hope that people could air their different opinions without getting into name calling and personal insults. We should all be able to just agree to disagree on certain topics. there are two schools of thought on clipping and neither one is all right nor all wrong. I believe it should be personal choice to be made after weighing both the pros and the cons and hopefully with input from your avian vet, as well as your own personal level of ability to train and maintain a flighted bird. It is true that clipped birds can still fly. Never make the mistake of believing that they can't. Even a clipped bird with a good updraft can fly away and be lost. There is nothing more heartbreakinging than losing one's bird whether they can or can't fly. Just ask those who have lost them. Please try to refrain from personal insults in the future and just enjoy the forum.